{"id":3844,"date":"2021-04-19T06:51:25","date_gmt":"2021-04-19T06:51:25","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/desteptati.ro\/?p=3844"},"modified":"2021-04-27T11:28:15","modified_gmt":"2021-04-27T11:28:15","slug":"stenograma-intrevederii-romano-sovietice-din-27-decembrie-1989-ora-10-01","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/desteptati-va.ro\/index.php\/2021\/04\/19\/stenograma-intrevederii-romano-sovietice-din-27-decembrie-1989-ora-10-01\/","title":{"rendered":"Stenograma \u00eentrevederii rom\u00e2no-sovietice din 27 decembrie 1989, ora 10.01"},"content":{"rendered":"<div class=\"post-content\"><div class='booster-block booster-read-block'>\n                <div class=\"twp-read-time\">\n                \t<i class=\"booster-icon twp-clock\"><\/i> <span>Read Time:<\/span>22 Minute, 1 Second                <\/div>\n\n            <\/div><h3 style=\"text-align: center;\"><em>Printre participan\u0163i: Ion Iliescu (pre\u015fedinteleCFSN), <\/em><em>Petre Roman (prim-ministrul Rom\u00e2niei), Evgheni<\/em> <em>Tiajelnikov (ambasadorul <\/em><em>URSS <\/em><em>la Bucure\u015ftii<\/em><em>)<\/em><\/h3>\r\n<h3><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h3>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen primul r\u00e2nd sunt bucuros c\u0103 am posibilitate, \u015fi din partea tovar\u0103\u015fului Gorbaciov \u015fi din \u00eens\u0103rcinarea lui s\u0103 \u00eenm\u00e2nez textul\u00a0 felicit\u0103rii adresate cu ocazia victoriei revolu\u0163iei \u015fi constituirii Consiliului Frontului. Nu \u00eel citesc. \u00cel cunoa\u015fte\u0163i. A fost publicat. Felicit\u0103rile au fost transmise prin radio. De aceea, tovar\u0103\u015ful Gorbaciov m-a rugat s\u0103-l \u00eenm\u00e2nez \u00een mod personal.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">V\u0103 cunoa\u015fte foarte bine trecutul, via\u0163a de lupt\u0103 si sigur este foarte bucuros c\u0103 Consiliul Frontului v-a ales \u00een aceast\u0103 func\u0163ie de mare importan\u0163\u0103. De asemenea, pre\u015fedintele Consiliului de Mini\u015ftri v\u0103 roag\u0103 s\u0103 primi\u0163i felicit\u0103ri sincere cu prilejul alegerii \u00een func\u0163ia de pre\u015fedinte al Consiliului Frontului. Dumneavoastr\u0103 a\u0163i condus \u0163ara \u00een cea mai grea perioad\u0103, c\u00e2nd patrio\u0163ii rom\u00e2ni au ac\u0163ionat hot\u0103r\u00e2t pentru salvarea na\u0163iunii de for\u0163ele arbitrare \u015fi teroriste, pentru afirmarea ordinii, \u00eencet\u0103\u0163enirii democra\u0163iei reale pe teritoriul s\u0103u.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen\u0163eleg\u00e2nd \u00eentreaga complexitate \u015fi importan\u0163\u0103 a sarcinilor care stau \u00een fa\u0163a Frontului, vreau s\u0103 v\u0103 asigur c\u0103 poporul rom\u00e2n prieten \u00eent\u00e2lne\u015fte, \u00een calea \u00eennoirii, sprijinul din partea popoarelor conducerii URSS. \u0162\u0103rile noastre sunt legate prin leg\u0103turi \u00eendelungate \u015fi puternice de alian\u0163\u0103, leg\u0103turi rodnice economice \u015fi culturale. Sunt \u00eencredin\u0163at c\u0103 acum se deschid posibilit\u0103\u0163i largi pentru dezvoltarea \u015fi \u00eent\u0103rirea colabor\u0103rii rom\u00e2no-sovietice \u00een folosul reciproc al popoarelor noastre, \u00een interesul p\u0103cii trainice \u015fi stabilit\u0103\u0163i \u00een Europa. Ajutoarele vor fi transmise.<\/h4>\r\n<h3 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion iliescu:<\/strong><\/h3>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">V\u0103 rog s\u0103 transmite\u0163i mul\u0163umiri tovar\u0103\u015fului Gorbaciov din partea mea. Putem vorbi la telefon. Vom face un text, \u00eel vom da la pres\u0103 imediat.<\/h4>\r\n<h3 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h3>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Dac\u0103 nu v\u0103 sup\u0103ra\u0163i, s\u0103 termin\u0103m cu partea protocolar\u0103. Doresc s\u0103 \u00eendeplinesc \u015fi \u00eens\u0103rcinarea dat\u0103 de tovar\u0103\u015ful R\u00eejkov cu prilejul revolu\u0163iei \u015fi constituirii Consiliului, \u201eexprim\u00e2nd speran\u0163a c\u0103 leg\u0103turile rom\u00e2no-sovietice se vor dezvolta rodnic, \u00een intereresul men\u0163inerii transform\u0103rilor ad\u00e2nci democratice, revolu\u0163ionare din \u0163\u0103rile noastre, \u00eent\u0103ririi prieteniei \u015fi colabor\u0103rii multilaterale \u00eentre popoarele URSS \u015fi Rom\u00e2niei. V\u0103 adresez succes \u00een \u00eenalta dv. misiune&#8221;.<\/h4>\r\n<figure id=\"attachment_1120\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-1120\" style=\"width: 364px\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\"><a href=\"http:\/\/www.desteptati-va.ro\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/03\/tiaj.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\" wp-image-1120\" title=\"Evgheni Tiajelnikov\" src=\"http:\/\/www.desteptati-va.ro\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/03\/tiaj.jpg\" alt=\"Evgheni Tiajelnikov\" width=\"364\" height=\"361\" \/><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-1120\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/figcaption><\/figure>\r\n<h4><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">V\u0103 mul\u0163umesc foarte mult. V\u0103 rog s\u0103 transmite\u0163i tovar\u0103\u015fului R\u00eejkov. aceste mul\u0163umiri.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Dorim tovar\u0103\u015fi, s\u0103 \u015ftim de ce ave\u0163i nevoie, din punct de vedere politic, de armament, acum imediat \u015fi de asemenea \u015fi pentru perspectiv\u0103, \u00een viitor. Este vorba de ajutor umanitar, ajutor de ordin militar, economic. Conducerea sovietic\u0103 este gata s\u0103 trimit\u0103 la Bucure\u015fti o delega\u0163ie, pe tovar\u0103\u015ful \u015eevardnadze, care s\u0103 aib\u0103 consult\u0103ri cu primul ministru, cu ministrul de Externe, \u015fi s\u0103 elabor\u0103m un program solid de colaborare \u00een interesul sus\u0163inerii revolu\u0163iei, a\u015fa cum a ar\u0103tat tovar\u0103\u015ful Gorbaciov, \u00een rezolvarea problemelor cele mai acute care stau \u00een fa\u0163a revolu\u0163iei.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Este foarte bine asta. V\u0103 mul\u0163umesc. Avem nevoie de sprijin, c\u0103 aceasta este cea mai important\u0103 problem\u0103 acum, sprijin moral \u015fi politic. Conducerea dumneavoastr\u0103 a f\u0103cut acest lucru de la \u00eenceput, imediat. Eu nu m-am \u00eendoit de acest lucru \u015fi to\u0163i care m-au \u00eentrebat cum o s\u0103 vad\u0103 \u0163\u0103rile socialiste aceast\u0103 mi\u015fcare a noastr\u0103, am spus nu-\u015fi fac\u0103 probleme.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">In ce prive\u015fte ajutorul umanitar, primim din toate \u0163\u0103rile \u015fi din partea dumneavoastr\u0103. S-au acordat multe ajutoare ieri, am discutat despre acest lucru. Cel mai important este c\u0103 Mihail Gorbaciov a propus s\u0103 discut\u0103m problemele dezvolt\u0103rii viitoare a opera\u0163iunilor.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Deocamdat\u0103 \u00eens\u0103 este greu, pentru c\u0103 nu suntem \u00eenc\u0103\u00a0 organiza\u0163i, pentru c\u0103 asta n-a fost o lovitur\u0103 dat\u0103 de cineva anume, ci particularitatea procesului de la noi, spre deosebire de alte \u0163\u0103ri socialiste este c\u0103 Ceau\u015fescu \u015fi acoli\u0163ii lui au dus \u0163ara la o asemenea\u00a0 catastrof\u0103 \u00eenc\u00e2t a dus la explozia maselor, masele l-au respins, nimeni nu a \u015ftiut nimic dinainte, a fost opera tuturor, opera tineretului.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Nimeni n-a \u015ftiut, n-a fost acolo inten\u0163ionat. Ne-a dus valul N-a fost nimic organizat.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Noi ne-am bucurat de simpatia acestor mase. Ceau\u015fescu a reu\u015fit s\u0103 creeze o asemenea situa\u0163ie \u00een \u0163ar\u0103, \u00een ceea ce prive\u015fte PCR \u015fi comuni\u015ftii, \u00eenc\u00e2t dac\u0103 n-ar fi fost \u015fi comuni\u015fti care s\u0103 se bucure de sprijin, nu \u015ftiu&#8230; Nu \u015ftiu cum o s\u0103 fie, nu putem vorbi despre PCR.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">N-a fost o campanie anticomunist\u0103, s-a creat o asemenea atmosfer\u0103 \u00een jurul partidului din motivele ar\u0103tate mai \u00eenainte. Din aceast\u0103 cauz\u0103 am f\u0103cut o platform\u0103 pentru toate for\u0163ele \u015fi tendin\u0163ele. Nu ne trebuie partide pe interese, sectare, ci o platforma politic\u0103 care s\u0103 uneasc\u0103 toate for\u0163ele, tendin\u0163ele, for\u0163ele creatoare ale \u0163\u0103rii| \u015fi pe aceast\u0103 platform\u0103 s\u0103 ac\u0163ion\u0103m \u015fi, cum a\u0163i v\u0103zut, o asemenea abordare a primit aprobarea tuturor, chiar \u00een condi\u0163iile acestea de teroare, oamenii ac\u0163ioneaz\u0103 cu succes.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">In primele zile s-a creat haos, a fost o criz\u0103 de putere \u015fi un vacuum, pentru c\u0103, neav\u00e2nd for\u0163e care s\u0103 organizeze lovitura, nu exist\u0103 structuri. Acum abia organiz\u0103m aceast\u0103 structur\u0103. Noi acum lucr\u0103m cu acei oameni tineri care au fost cu noi acolo, \u00een ceasul revolu\u0163iei.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Cu oameni de 24 de ani. <em>(Este prezentat un t\u00e2n\u0103r &#8211; Mihai) <\/em>El a luat leg\u0103tura cu mine \u015fi a spus: \u201eEu sunt cu dumneavoastr\u0103&#8221;. To\u0163i ace\u015fti oameni tineri sunt inteligen\u0163i \u015fi capabili, c\u0103rora li s-au deschis alte orizonturi. Asta este revolu\u0163ia tineretului. N-avem nicio legal\u0103tur\u0103 cu\u00a0 organizarea acestui miting de mas\u0103. Nu \u015ftiu personal cum am ajuns la tribun\u0103, cum am ajuns s\u0103 vorbesc.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Reflec\u0163ia maturit\u0103\u0163ii politice a maselor! To\u0163i au \u00een\u0163eles c\u0103 este necesar s\u0103 se fac\u0103 ceea ce s-a f\u0103cut c\u00e2nd au v\u0103zut activitatea acestor terori\u015fti, pentru c\u0103 Ceau\u015fescu a pr\u0103bu\u015fit toat\u0103 economia, \u00eentreaga via\u0163\u0103 a \u0163\u0103rii, dar a creat un asemenea organ de represiune, pentru era singura posibilitate de sus\u0163inere a puterii lui. Aparatul a fost instruit\u00a0 foarte bine, ca un robot programat, care \u015fi dup\u0103 dispari\u0163ia lui a ac\u0163ionat\u00a0 \u015fi creat situa\u0163ii grele \u015fi noi nu am \u00een\u0163eles la \u00eenceput c\u0103\u00a0 exist\u0103 un asemenea grup de terori\u015fti. Oamenii \u00een mod spontan s-au prezentat s\u0103 lucreze, s\u0103 apere, s\u0103 ne apere.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">La mine, so\u0163ia a r\u0103mas singur\u0103 \u015fi au fost semnale c\u0103 au vrut s\u0103-mi ia prizonieri membrii familiei mele \u015fi pe tovar\u0103\u015fii mei \u015fi trei tineri plecat atunci imediat la locuin\u0163a mea s\u0103 mi-o p\u0103zeasc\u0103. Mama locuie\u015fte la marginea Bucure\u015ftiului, este singur\u0103, \u00eentr-un cartier, la bloc. Am luat leg\u0103tura cu ea dup\u0103 dou\u0103 zile, am \u00eentrebat-o ce s-a \u00eent\u00e2mplat \u015fi mi-a zis: \u201eVezi-\u0163i de treab\u0103, pentru c\u0103 oamenii au venit \u015fi mi-au spus c\u0103 m\u0103 vor ap\u0103ra. Mi-au propus s\u0103 m\u0103 mut, dar n-am vrut&#8221;. \u015ei atunci cei din blocul respectiv au creat o gard\u0103 de oameni care au ap\u0103rat-o \u015fi multe, multe asemenea situa\u0163ii. Este un moment, revolu\u0163ia aceasta care a trezit la via\u0163\u0103 asemenea poten\u0163iale care st\u0103teau \u00een profunzimea oamenilor este partea bun\u0103. Sigur c\u0103 avem mari greut\u0103\u0163i, c\u0103 se pun probleme legate de domeniul economic, social, dar s\u0103 sper\u0103m c\u0103 le vom trece.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen ce prive\u015fte propunerea sovietic\u0103 ca \u015eevardnadze s\u0103 vin\u0103 \u00een Rom\u00e2nia, suntem bucuro\u015fi, numai c\u0103 trebuie s\u0103 ne preg\u0103tim \u015fi noi, leilem c\u00e2nd se va putea realiza, ca s\u0103 avem posibilitatea s\u0103 ne preg\u0103tim s\u0103 discut\u0103m concret. \u00cen paralel, sigur, eu zic c\u0103 \u015fi putem vorbi de livrarea de petrol, de gaze. Trebuie, repet, s\u0103 sim\u0163im bine , tendin\u0163ele, s\u0103 cunoa\u015ftem problemele, s\u0103 semn\u0103m unele documente, cum se vor face aceste livr\u0103ri, pe decade, nu numai pe trimestru. A\u015fa este bine pentru to\u0163i. \u015ei apoi discut\u0103m \u00een ce prive\u015fte perspectiva. M\u0103 g\u00e2ndesc la specialitatea dumneavoastr\u0103, de pild\u0103, sunte\u0163i energitician.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Au fost speciali\u015fti aici, au studiat problema moderniz\u0103rii sistemului energetic rom\u00e2n \u015fi au fost elaborate propuneri. Eu cred c\u0103 trebuie s\u0103 ne \u00eentoarcem la acest program, la aceste programe, pentru c\u0103 sunt c\u0103l\u0103uzele posibilit\u0103\u0163ii de colaborare; este vorba de capacitatea metalurgic\u0103, a industriei metalurgice, a \u00eentreprinderilor chimice. Nu mai vorbesc de posibilitatea cre\u0103rii de \u00eentreprinderi pentru a folosi capacit\u0103\u0163ile dumneavoastr\u0103, practic, mai bine.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Este o problem\u0103 mai important\u0103.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">A\u015f fi mul\u0163umit dac\u0103 Guvernul, tovar\u0103\u015ful Roman, ar da aten\u0163ie acestor probleme, pentru c\u0103 ave\u0163i acum mii de alte probleme, dar \u015fi acestea trebuie rezolvate. Poate c\u0103 ar putea s\u0103 vin\u0103 \u00a0\u00a0 \u015eevardnadze, o serie de mini\u015ftri sovietici care se ocup\u0103 de respectivele sectoare, domenii de activitate, sau vicepremierul nostru, domenii \u00een care exist\u0103 perspective bune de colaborare. Am venit prin Chi\u015fin\u0103u. Am ajuns greu la Bucure\u015fti. Am stat 6 ore la Bac\u0103u\u00a0 pentru c\u0103 nu era curent electric.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Dar acum este \u00een ordine aproape totul.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">La Moscova, timpul nu era bun. Tovar\u0103\u015ful Gorbaciov personal m-a ajutat s\u0103 ajung cu avionul mai repede la Chi\u015fin\u0103u \u015fi venit astfel s\u0103 v\u0103 felicit \u015fi s\u0103 v\u0103 ofer ajutorul nostru. Moldova, cei de acolo vor s\u0103 v\u0103 transmit c\u0103 sunt gata s\u0103 colaboreze cu dumneavoastr\u0103, s\u0103-\u015fi trimit\u0103 tovar\u0103\u015fi aici, s\u0103 se discute problemele acestei colabor\u0103ri. Sunt probleme comune \u00een anumite domenii \u015fi dac\u0103 ne vom uni for\u0163ele tuturor oamenilor de \u015ftiin\u0163\u0103, ale celor care lucreaz\u0103 \u00een domeniile respective, numai a\u015fa vom putea rezolva problemele.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Asta este \u00een avantajul reciproc. Trebuie \u00eens\u0103 s\u0103 se lucrezi la acest nivel nemijlocit.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen Moldova exist\u0103 aceast\u0103 dorin\u0163\u0103 sincer\u0103. Tovar\u0103\u015ful Gorbaciov \u015fi Biroul Politic ar fi recunosc\u0103tori dac\u0103 ne-a\u0163i spune care aprecierea dumneavoastr\u0103 p^vind etapa actual\u0103 a Revolu\u0163ii situa\u0163iei politice de mas\u0103. M\u0103car pe scurt.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion\u00a0 Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen primul r\u00e2nd, a\u015fa cum am spus, elementul fundamental este caracterul revolu\u0163iei. La noi, caracterul spontan al acestei mi\u015fc\u0103ri, spre deosebire de evolu\u0163ia precedent\u0103, care a \u00eempins \u0163ara \u00eentr-o criz\u0103 profund\u0103, multilateral\u0103, nu avea alt\u0103 solu\u0163ie dec\u00e2t explozia revolu\u0163ionar\u0103. Mult m-am mai g\u00e2ndit la trecerea aceasta, c\u0103 dac\u0103 nu vom capabili s\u0103 ac\u0163ion\u0103m cu for\u0163e organizate, c\u0103 dac\u0103 partidul \u00eensu\u015fi nu este \u00een stare s\u0103-\u015fi asigure rolul conduc\u0103tor \u015fi s\u0103 r\u0103m\u00e2n\u0103, atunci a fost clar pentru mine de la \u00eenceput c\u0103 dac\u0103 nu se produce, deci, acest lucru, se produce explozia, dar o explozie periculoas\u0103 pentru partid care poate fi luat cu valul, \u015fi a\u015fa s-a \u00eent\u00e2mplat.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Acum trebuie lucrat individual, ca s\u0103 evit\u0103m \u00eempingerea spre dreapta a proceselor, a problemelor sociale de la noi. \u015ei eu cred c\u0103, punct de vedere politic, preocuparea principal\u0103 a celor c\u00e2\u0163iva care suntem aici este de a contribui la o dezvoltare s\u0103n\u0103toas\u0103, pe calea revolu\u0163ionar\u0103, \u015fi s\u0103 fr\u00e2n\u0103m posibilitatea elementelor de dreapta de a prelua comanda, tendin\u0163e care se manifest\u0103 \u015fi \u00een alte socialiste.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Instrumentul g\u00e2ndit, rapid ne-a venit ideea, pentru c\u0103 a fost clar c\u0103 altceva nu avem de f\u0103cut, a fost ideea acestui Front, Frontul Salv\u0103rii Na\u0163ionale, subliniind acest lucru prin denumirea lui, c\u0103 \u0163ara toat\u0103\u00a0 este \u00een pericol \u015fi c\u0103 aceasta creeaz\u0103 o platform\u0103 real\u0103 de interese comune ale tuturor sus\u0163in\u0103torilor \u015fi nu ne-am mai adresat mul\u0163imii ca o sec\u0163iune, ca o for\u0163\u0103 conduc\u0103toare, ci am exprimat ideea necesit\u0103\u0163ii consensului \u015fi unirii tuturor for\u0163elor interesate \u00een \u00eens\u0103n\u0103to\u015firea vie\u0163ii economice, sociale, \u015fi ne bucur\u0103m, ne bucur\u0103 faptul c\u0103 n-am gre\u015fit \u00een evaluarea noastr\u0103 \u015fi c\u0103 ecoul a fost pozitiv \u015fi cel pu\u0163in \u00een acest moment exist\u0103 unanimitate \u00een jurul platformei Frontului, asta \u00eenseamn\u0103 c\u0103 am \u00eenvins, tendin\u0163e viitoare fiind \u00eens\u0103 posibile.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Am proclamat ideea plurit\u0103\u0163ii politice, n-am spus mai mult dec\u00e2t pluritate, n-am confundat pluripartismul cu pluri-partide. Nu excludem posibilitatea apari\u0163iei \u015fi de partide \u015fi de tot felul de organiza\u0163ii, ba, chiar din punctul nostru de vedere, cu c\u00e2t vor fi mai multe, cu at\u00e2t mai bine, va fi mai pu\u0163in periculos pentru unitate dec\u00e2t dac\u0103 s-ar crea o singur\u0103 for\u0163\u0103. \u00cei l\u0103s\u0103m s\u0103 se difuzeze \u015fi apoi o s\u0103 accept\u0103m un dialog \u00een cadrul Frontului.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Platforma este a\u015fa \u00eenc\u00e2t poate fi acceptat\u0103 de oricine.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cei chem\u0103m pe to\u0163i sub platforma Frontului. C\u0103 \u00een cadrul ei sunt interese particulare care le exprim\u0103 \u00eentr-o form\u0103 sau alta, interese politice, treaba lor. Cam aceasta este ceea ce am reu\u015fit \u015fi deocamdat\u0103 este pozitiv.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen acela\u015fi timp, am promis s\u0103 organiz\u0103m alegeri libere, pentru c\u0103 trebuie s\u0103 se organizeze o nou\u0103 putere, aceast\u0103 form\u0103 tranzitorie poate s\u0103 dureze mult. Pentru stabilitate trebuie organizate alegeri. Au fost presiuni mari s\u0103 le facem mai repede. Nu am fi putut s\u0103 tr\u0103im\u00a0 \u00een formele tranzitorii \u015fi am acceptat, dar va fi greu s\u0103 preg\u0103tim \u00eentr-o durat\u0103 a\u015fa de scurt\u0103 \u015fi baza constitu\u0163ional\u0103, legislativ\u0103 a organiz\u0103rii \u015fi platforma conceptual\u0103 cu care s\u0103 ne prezent\u0103m. Elementele de baz\u0103 sunt aici \u015fi ele au prins, dar \u015fi mai important este ca, platforma conceptual\u0103, pe care o vom elabora \u00eenc\u0103 \u015fi cornpleta, este important ca \u00een aceste trei-patru luni s\u0103 avem \u015fi rezultate practice, c\u0103 pentru mase nu at\u00e2t proclama\u0163iile, nu at\u00e2t comisiile, nu at\u00e2t perspectivele sunt importante, ci ceea ce simt ele \u00een via\u0163\u0103. Lumea s-a s\u0103turat de vorbe \u015fi promisiuni.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">De aceea, pentru noi principalul element al platformei electorale este ca \u00een aceste trei-patru luni s\u0103 se demonstreze capacitatea de a ac\u0163iona \u00een practic\u0103, \u00een via\u0163\u0103, \u00een interesul oamenilor, \u015fi de aceea \u00eenc\u0103 nu suntem constitui\u0163i ca putere de stat, ca guvern, dar de aparatul existent, primele m\u0103suri, de \u00eenceput, pe l\u00e2ng\u0103 cele au fost s\u0103 rezolv\u0103m c\u00e2teva probleme imediate \u00een sprijinul oamenilor. \u015ei printre altele au avut un mare ecou c\u00e2teva decrete scoase \u015fi publicate ieri, care au \u00eenl\u0103turat ni\u015fte lucruri cu efect negativ \u00een via\u0163a lor, ni\u015fte legi care smulgeau din venitul oamenilor, era concep\u0163ia lui Ceau\u015fescu. Pe de o parte, platforme privind nivelul de trai \u015fi cre\u015fterea salariilor, a acestui nivel, \u015fi apoi tot felul de legi care s\u0103 smulg\u0103 din venitul oamenilor, ca pre\u0163urile majorate la c\u0103ldur\u0103, energie. Am \u00eenl\u0103turat c\u00e2teva asemenea reglement\u0103ri care s\u0103 u\u015fureze via\u0163a oamenilor, ca de pild\u0103 legea cu \u00eentreruperea sarcinilor \u015fi alte legi.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Am anulat legi antiumane!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Este mult mai important dec\u00e2t proclama\u0163iile, pentru c\u0103 oamenii simt c\u0103 problemele lor, pentru noi sunt prioritare \u015fi vrem s\u0103 le realiz\u0103m \u00een program.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">V\u0103 nuil\u0163umim pentru ajutor. \u015ei alte \u0163\u0103ri au fost generoase cu noi, ne-au ajutat s\u0103 amelior\u0103m aprovizionarea popula\u0163iei pe pia\u0163\u0103. \u015ei \u00een situa\u0163ia aceasta grea, sub focul terori\u015ftilor, oamenii s-au aprovizionat mai bine dec\u00e2t \u00een \u201eEpoca de Aur a lui Ceau\u015fescu&#8221;.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Terori\u015ftii mai exist\u0103 \u00eenc\u0103!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Au fost\u00a0 \u00eencerc\u0103ri asupra dumneavoastr\u0103?<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion lliescu<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Au fost. Putem s\u0103 spunem c\u0103 exist\u0103 ni\u015fte for\u0163e bine organizate.Nu \u015ftim ce for\u0163e au ac\u0163ionat. Siria, Libia s-au dezis c\u0103 ar fi organizatorii acestor for\u0163e \u015fi am primit cu satisfac\u0163ie aceste declara\u0163ii.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cei consider\u0103m sprijinitori \u00een solda lui Ceau\u015fescu \u015fi era \u00een caracterul lui s\u0103-\u015fi asigure asemenea oameni.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion lliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">For\u0163a principal\u0103 venea din organele de Interne \u015fi Securitate, care se umflaser\u0103 cu un aparat foarte puternic \u015fi unit\u0103\u0163i opera\u0163ionale foarte puternice. In ultimii ani de zile, Ceau\u015fescu se temea. Au fost \u00eencerc\u0103ri din partea unor cadre superioare ale Armatei de a organiza r\u0103sturnarea lui Ceau\u015fescu, au sim\u0163it c\u0103 nu exist\u0103 for\u0163e politice capabile s\u0103-l r\u0103stoarne. Ceau\u015fescu a \u00eenl\u0103turat toate elementele politice capabile din conducerea partidului, s-a \u00eenconjurat de lachei, oameni lipsi\u0163i de personalitate, lega\u0163i de el, \u015fi nu erau posibile niciun fel de ac\u0163iuni \u00een interiorul partidului. Au fost descoperite aceste c\u00e2teva \u00eencerc\u0103ri, a \u00eencepu t s\u0103 schimbe comandan\u0163ii Armatei, pe de o parte, iar pe de alt\u0103 parte, a sl\u0103bit foarte serios dotarea Armatei cu tehnic\u0103 de lupt\u0103.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">In anumite perioade, unit\u0103\u0163ile militare nu aveau armament; aveau arme, dar nu aveau armament, el \u0163inea totul \u00een m\u00e2n\u0103. Nu d\u0103dea carburant unit\u0103\u0163ilor militare, nu se d\u0103dea carburant dec\u00e2t cu aprobarea personal\u0103 a lui, ceea ce arat\u0103 c\u0103 se temea. In schimb a creat unit\u0103\u0163i de lupt\u0103, de Securitate, cu mare eficien\u0163\u0103 tehnico-militar\u0103, cu tehnic\u0103 american\u0103 \u015fi japonez\u0103, printre altele \u015fi unit\u0103\u0163i cu profesioni\u015fti de \u00eenalt\u0103 clas\u0103, pu\u015fca\u015fi, luneti\u015fti, instrui\u0163i foarte serios. Acestea au constituit elementul de baz\u0103. Noi am fost \u00een aceast\u0103 situa\u0163ie c\u00e2nd a trebuit s\u0103 ne organiz\u0103m, pentru c\u0103 prima chestiune era s\u0103 salv\u0103m oamenii, s\u0103 oprim m\u0103celul. Armata toat\u0103 a fost al\u0103turi de noi, popula\u0163ia, de asemenea.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Dar, din fericire, nu Armata a f\u0103cut revolu\u0163ia. Ea nu a tras \u00een popula\u0163ie \u015fi s-a al\u0103turat revolu\u0163iei, dar revolu\u0163ia este a poporului.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen confruntarea aceasta \u00eentre Armat\u0103 \u015fi oamenii organelor represiune, pu\u015fca\u015fii ace\u015ftia care au \u0163inut \u0163ara sub teroare, \u00een timp ce ei aveau tehnic\u0103 militar\u0103 \u00eenalt\u0103, instruc\u0163ie militar\u0103 \u00eenalt\u0103, solda\u0163ii no\u015ftri erau \u00een inferioritate ca preg\u0103tire. Armata, p\u00e2n\u0103 acum, era for\u0163a de munc\u0103 gratuit\u0103.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u201eSclavii moderni&#8221;.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Folosi\u0163i \u00een agricultur\u0103 la munci, \u00een construc\u0163ii, iar instruc\u0163ia militar\u0103 era inexistent\u0103. Ne spuneau speciali\u015ftii militari c\u0103 \u00een ceea ce prive\u015fte eficacitatea unui pu\u015fca\u015f instruit ne situ\u0103m, dup\u0103 aprecierea lor, un pu\u015fca\u015f corespunde la 60 de solda\u0163i de-ai no\u015ftri din punct de vedere al eficacit\u0103\u0163ii. Sunt instrui\u0163i pentru activit\u0103\u0163i individuale, stimulative.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen grup de c\u00e2te patru, pentru ac\u0163iuni mobile, cu cea mai mare mobilitate, puteau s\u0103 loveasc\u0103 acum aici \u015fi peste 10 minute la un kilometru. Osta\u015fii no\u015ftri sunt nepreg\u0103ti\u0163i pentru lupta \u00een ora\u015f, ci se instruiesc pentru lupta de front \u00een forma\u0163ii unite, masive. Li s-a interzis s\u0103 se organizeze trupe de interven\u0163ie ale Armatei, li s-a interzis direct de c\u0103tre Ceau\u015fescu.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Din p\u0103cate, la aceste distrugeri a contribuit \u015fi aceast\u0103 situa\u015fie.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Dac\u0103 se poate s\u0103 cunoa\u015ftem \u00eentreaga componen\u0163\u0103 a Consiliului \u015fi care este structura lui \u015fi nucleul conduc\u0103tor.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Numele? Am \u00eentocmit o list\u0103 pe picior, \u00een focul luptei, \u00een b\u0103t\u0103lie, cu cei care erau pe baricade. Acesta a fost primul nucleu, dar \u00a0\u00eempreun\u0103 am convenit c\u0103 asta nu corespunde unei reprezent\u0103ri corespunz\u0103toare \u015fi ne-am l\u0103sat r\u0103gazul s\u0103 g\u00e2ndim o integrare mai larg\u0103 a\u00a0 unor reprezentan\u0163i ai tuturor straturilor, categoriilor. Avem o \u015fedin\u0163\u0103 cu acest prim nucleu, 30 de persoane, pe care vrem s\u0103-l l\u0103rgim p\u00e2n\u0103 la 101 membri. Intre ace\u015ftia vor fi 41 de pre\u015fedin\u0163i ai consiliilor jude\u0163ene ale Frontului.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Exist\u0103, deci, deja \u015fi la jude\u0163e?<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Cunoa\u015ftem c\u0103 exist\u0103.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Acum, o grup\u0103 de oameni \u00eentocme\u015fte lista acestor pre\u015fedin\u0163i de pentru c\u0103 nu \u015ftim cine sunt, cum se numesc. Este pentru prima oar\u0103 c\u00e2nd lucr\u0103m \u00eentr-un sediu al nostru. Noi ne aflam \u00een pericol. Nu pu leam \u00eent\u00e2lni nici m\u0103car cu cei 30. Ne-au \u00eempiedicat s\u0103 muncim democratic. Unii ne-au \u015fi spus-o \u015fi am spus c\u0103 au dreptate: \u201eUnde ne \u00eent\u00e2lnim, vre\u0163i ca acest nucleu s\u0103 fie \u00eempu\u015fcat?&#8221;. Ast\u0103zi ne amenaj\u0103m un spa\u0163iu de lucru, discut\u0103m r\u0103spunderile pe ni\u015fte criterii. S\u0103 avem reprezentan\u0163i \u015fi din r\u00e2ndul muncitorilor -sunt c\u00e2\u0163iva tineri care au fost \u00een pia\u0163\u0103 -, vrem \u00eens\u0103 s\u0103 cerem din unit\u0103\u0163ile mari din Bucure\u015fti, din \u00eentreprinderile mari, din alte centre industriale, deci, reprezentan\u0163i ai muncitorilor, minerilor din Valea Jiului, pentru a-i prinde \u00een Consiliu, reprezentan\u0163ii intelectualit\u0103\u0163ii, studen\u0163ilor, tinerilor, c\u00e2teva figuri cunoscute ale vie\u0163ii culturale, figuri proeminente, din partea agriculturii trebuie s\u0103 vedem&#8230; Ast\u0103zi vrem s\u0103 prezent\u0103m o structur\u0103 mai larg\u0103 Consiliului Frontului. Asta s-a \u00eent\u00e2mplat tocmai pentru c\u0103 nu a fost planificat\u0103 revolu\u0163ia.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Va fi un birou al Consiliului?<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Deocamdat\u0103, practic, biroul a ac\u0163ionat. S-a constituit \u015fi a ac\u0163ionat sub focul armelor \u015fi au f\u0103cut fa\u0163\u0103 terori\u015ftilor.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Doamna Cornea \u015fi al\u0163ii&#8230; ce se \u00eent\u00e2mpl\u0103 cu ei?<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Doamna Cornea este pre\u015fedinta de onoare a Frontului de la Cluj. Au scos-o din \u00eenchisoare \u015fi au pus-o \u00een frunte ca pre\u015fedinte de onoare. Pre\u015fedinte este un actor de la Cluj. Sunt \u015fi probleme \u00een faza aceasta, ni\u015fte lucruri care puteau \u015fi pot produce greut\u0103\u0163i \u015fi anarhie \u015fi nu am rezolvat aceste probleme.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Aceste organisme care s-au creat din oameni nemul\u0163umi\u0163i, \u00a0suspicio\u015fi pe to\u0163i cei care au lucrat chiar corect \u00een organele vechii puteri, au \u00eenceput s\u0103-i \u00eenl\u0103ture din func\u0163ii pe to\u0163i cei care conduceau activitatea local\u0103, economia local\u0103 \u015fi aceste organe acum stagneaz\u0103, organe care rezolvau probleme vitale ale oamenilor. Este o perioad\u0103 de \u201eb\u00e2lb\u00e2ial\u0103&#8221; p\u00e2n\u0103 se pun \u00een func\u0163ii oameni capabili, competen\u0163i, \u00a0s\u0103-i convingem c\u0103 nu to\u0163i cei care au f\u0103cut parte din vechiul aparat sunt o ap\u0103 \u015fi-un p\u0103m\u00e2nt, s\u0103-i p\u0103str\u0103m, s\u0103-i folosim \u015fi pe cei cu experien\u0163\u0103, utili, capabili \u015fi, de asemenea, s\u0103 propunem oameni mai mul\u0163i.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Interesant. Alegerile vor fi concomitent \u015fi pentru Marea Adunare Na\u0163ional\u0103 \u015fi pentru Consiliu.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Vom mai vedea.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Tovar\u0103\u015ful Mihail Gorbaciov m-a rugat s\u0103 m\u0103 interesez dac\u0103 \u00a0ideea de Partid Comunist va r\u0103m\u00e2ne.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Nu \u015ftiu. Nu \u015ftim cum vom rezolva aceast\u0103 problem\u0103! Deocamdat\u0103, dac\u0103 am pronun\u0163a numai acest cuv\u00e2nt&#8230;<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Te scuip\u0103.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Printre demonstran\u0163i au fost \u015fi lozinci \u201eF\u0103r\u0103 comuni\u015fti!&#8221;.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Vrem s\u0103 le d\u0103m \u00eencrederea \u00een posibilitatea realiz\u0103rii unei ac\u0163iuni comune a tuturor, indiferent ce sunt ei, \u015fi c\u0103 nu vrem s\u0103 restabilim vechile concepte \u015fi concep\u0163ii dep\u0103\u015fite despre comunism, despre partid. Eu, personal, sunt gata s\u0103 merg \u00een continuare f\u0103r\u0103 Partid, cu Frontul, care de fapt s\u0103 devin\u0103 for\u0163a politic\u0103 esen\u0163ial\u0103 a na\u0163iunii.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Asta ne l\u0103sat Ceau\u015fescu!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Dac\u0103 pute\u0163i s\u0103-mi spune\u0163i c\u00e2teva cuvinte despre formarea ternului.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Ast\u0103zi trebuie s\u0103 lucr\u0103m neap\u0103rat.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Ave\u0163i viceprim-ministru.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">A\u015fa a fost. Suntem doar doi!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Ave\u0163i ministru al Ap\u0103r\u0103rii Na\u0163ionale, ministru al Afacerilor? (Lips\u0103 r\u0103spuns \u00een stenogram\u0103, continu\u0103 cu o nou\u0103 interven\u0163ie nibasadorului sovietic.)<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Tovar\u0103\u015ful \u015eevardnadze s-a interesat de o serie de probleme cu Tratatul de la Var\u015fovia, cu CAER, este vorba de aparatul de lucru, dac\u0103 se vor mai \u00eent\u00e2lni reprezentan\u0163ii acestor organisme \u015fi grupele lor de lucru.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Eu cred c\u0103 Constantin Oancea \u015ftie. El a f\u0103cut parte, s-a ocupat.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Constantin Oancea:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Ne preg\u0103tim \u015fi mergem, normal!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Tovar\u0103\u015fii din conducere vor s\u0103 \u015ftie p\u0103rerea noilor lideri \u00een leg\u0103tur\u0103 cu \u201eglasnost&#8221; <em>(Principiu introdus de<\/em> <em>Mihail Gorbaciov,<\/em> \u201eglasnost&#8221; <em>se poate traduce prin \u201etransparen\u0163\u0103&#8221;<\/em> &#8211; n.a.).<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">\u00cen focul luptei, fiind vorba de o mi\u015fcare popular\u0103, de\u015fi am fost 4-5 oameni care am&#8230; ideea egalit\u0103\u0163ii era absolut fundamental\u0103.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Eu m-am ferit total s\u0103 zic m\u0103car ce am f\u0103cut, era lucru inadmisibil, ce merit aveam eu \u00een plus \u00een aceast\u0103 revolu\u0163ie? Exact ca \u015fi cei care sunt al\u0103turi \u015fi \u015fi-au riscat via\u0163a \u015fi erau zeci de mii! Nu aveam alt drept, niciunul. Trebuie s\u0103 fim foarte aten\u0163i. In leg\u0103tura cu aceasta, dac\u0103 Frontul nostru \u00eencearc\u0103 s\u0103 recupereze aceast\u0103 mi\u015fcare, eu m\u0103 dau la o parte \u015fi Ion la fel. Noi \u00een\u0163elegem s\u0103 canaliz\u0103m aceast\u0103 \u00a0mi\u015fcare pentru a \u00eens\u0103n\u0103to\u015fi societatea, a o democratiza, dar nu \u00een favoarea cuiva. Exact cum a spus Ion.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Mihail Gorbaciov vrea s\u0103 v\u0103 transmit \u00een mod sincer succes o dat\u0103 s\u0103 v\u0103 felicite pentru curaj \u015fi v\u0103 dorim s\u0103 formula\u0163i cur\u00e2nd ideile, programul dumneavoastr\u0103, organele dumneavoastr\u0103 de lucru pentru c\u0103 Congresul Deputa\u0163ilor Sovietului Suprem a fost informat de tovar\u0103\u015ful Gorbaciov despre situa\u0163ia din \u0163ara dumneavoastr\u0103 \u015fi sprijinul pe care-l acord\u0103m.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Am apreciat de la \u00eenceput modul inteligent \u00een care a ac\u0163ionat Gorbaciov personal \u015fi conducerea sovietic\u0103, chiar \u015fi \u00een leg\u0103tur\u0103 cu ajutorul sovietic. Francezii \u015fi americanii au aruncat o nad\u0103: &#8222;c\u0103 ar fi gata s\u0103-\u015fi modifice concep\u0163ia despre ideea de interven\u0163ie&#8221;. Asta este o alt\u0103 provocare. Am avut o consultare cu Gorbaciov de la militari (de la sediul MApN &#8211; n.a.). Ne puneam la un moment dat problema aceasta, c\u00e2nd Armata era \u00eengrijorat\u0103 \u015fi vedea c\u0103 nu are eficien\u0163a scontat\u0103, nu \u015ftia ce for\u0163e ac\u0163ioneaz\u0103, ce surse de informa\u0163ii au acestea. Unde organizam noi ceva, ap\u0103reau imediat!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Eram sub controlul lor, se pare!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Revolu\u0163ia era \u00een pericol \u015fi ne-am consultat \u00een leg\u0103tura cu o posibil\u0103 asisten\u0163\u0103 de specialitate \u015fi am c\u0103zut de acord c\u0103 nu e cazul, c\u0103 ar putea avea loc interpret\u0103ri nedorite \u015fi ar fi coincis cu aprecierea lui Ceau\u015fescu, care \u015fi la proces a spus c\u0103 este o lovitur\u0103 de stat cu ajutor militar str\u0103in. Lumea \u015ftie c\u0103 n-a fost a\u015fa!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Este clar asta. N-a fost. \u015ei felul cum Gorbaciov a prezentat \u00een Sovietul Suprem problema a fost inteligent.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Opinia noastr\u0103 public\u0103 s-a interesat mult, a citit interviul dumneavoastr\u0103 \u015fi l-a apreciat foarte mult. Au venit \u015fi ziari\u015ftii no\u015ftri \u015fi mi-au spus acest lucru. Am dori s\u0103 ne spune\u0163i dac\u0103 programul de dou\u0103 ore care s-a dat la televiziune \u00eel aprecia\u0163i.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Petre Roman:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Noi nu am v\u0103zut absolut nimic la televizor \u015fi niciun ziar, p\u00e2n\u0103 ieri pr\u00e2nz. Niciun ziar rom\u00e2nesc. N-am avut timp!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Orug\u0103minte: o serie de speciali\u015fti sovietici se afl\u0103 la periferie, cerem s\u0103 le acorda\u0163i ajutor, s\u0103 spune\u0163i celor care trebuie s\u0103 aib\u0103 grij\u0103 de securitatea lor, pentru c\u0103 n-au asupra lor documente: pa\u015fapoartele sunt la ambasad\u0103, au adeverin\u0163e, dar s-ar putea ca la control s\u0103 se recunoasc\u0103 aceste autoriza\u0163ii. Sunt \u00eentr-o situa\u0163ie grea!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Ion <strong>Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Nu avem organe de Securitate.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Am \u00een vedere organele Frontului.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Am p\u0103strat Mili\u0163ia pentru aceste chestiuni de ordine public\u0103. Securitatea a intrat \u00een competen\u0163a Armatei. Securitatea nu mai exist\u0103.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">De aceea, v-am ruga foarte mult s\u0103 da\u0163i indica\u0163ii corespun\u00adzitoare, ca s\u0103 fie asigurat\u0103 securitatea unor speciali\u015fti sovietici, intru c\u0103 Armata nu se va amesteca!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">F\u0103r\u0103 \u00eendoial\u0103!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman<\/strong>:<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Ace\u015ftia sunt terori\u015ftii&#8230;<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Avem deja doi r\u0103ni\u0163i din cl\u0103direa \u00een care s-a tras.<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Noi, de la Televiziune, vedeam cl\u0103direa dumneavoastr\u0103, dar nu puteam face nimic, eram sub foc permanent!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Ion Iliescu:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Trebuia s\u0103 lucr\u0103m, \u015fi-n jurul nostru, pe toate cl\u0103dirile erau pu\u015fca\u015fi, era punct strategic, punctul strategic nr. 1 al nostru. L-au atacat cu bombe incendiare, cu arunc\u0103toare de grenade! A fost un moment c\u00e2nd am vrut s\u0103 cerem ajutor! Un c\u0103pitan m-a salvat de la moarte, a sesizat un terorist cu pistolul \u00een m\u00e2n\u0103 \u00een spatele meu. Bine c\u0103 a observat. Nu l-am prins \u00eens\u0103!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Petre Roman:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">A fost dup\u0103 atacul cu bombe incendiare \u015fi arunc\u0103toare de grenade!<\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\"><strong>Evgheni Tiajelnikov:<\/strong><\/h4>\r\n<h4 style=\"text-align: justify;\">Cer scuze pentru re\u0163inerea \u00eentregii conduceri. V\u0103 mul|\u0163umesc. De asemenea, Mihail Gorbaciov m-a rugat s\u0103 v\u0103 transmit ca, prin Ambasada sovietic\u0103 la Bucure\u015fti, s\u0103 \u0163ine\u0163i leg\u0103tura \u015fi s\u0103 transmite\u0163i orice probleme, rug\u0103min\u0163i \u00een leg\u0103tur\u0103 cu ceea ce ave\u0163i nevoie \u015fi s\u0103 se ia leg\u0103tura cu tovar\u0103\u015fii care coordoneaz\u0103 aceste probleme ale dumneavoastr\u0103 <em>(prezint\u0103 doi tovar\u0103\u015fi <\/em><em>&#8211; <\/em><em>n.a.),<\/em> care cunosc problemele.\u00cen toat\u0103 aceast\u0103 perioad\u0103 au transmis informa\u0163ii acas\u0103 \u015fi vor p\u0103stra leg\u0103tura cu Frontul. V\u0103 mul\u0163umesc \u015fi v\u0103 doresc s\u0103 fi\u0163i forte, s\u0103 ave\u0163i for\u0163a s\u0103 trece\u0163i peste aceste probleme. Suntem cu dumneavoastr\u0103 . \u015ei v\u0103 dorim sincer succes!<\/h4>        <div class=\"booster-block booster-reactions-block\">\n            <div class=\"twp-reactions-icons\">\n                \n                <div class=\"twp-reacts-wrap\">\n                    <a react-data=\"be-react-1\" post-id=\"3844\" class=\"be-face-icons un-reacted\" href=\"javascript:void(0)\">\n                        <img decoding=\"async\" src=\"https:\/\/desteptati-va.ro\/wp-content\/plugins\/booster-extension\/\/assets\/icon\/happy.svg\" alt=\"Happy\">\n                    <\/a>\n                    <div class=\"twp-reaction-title\">\n                        Happy                    <\/div>\n                    <div class=\"twp-count-percent\">\n                                                    <span style=\"display: none;\" class=\"twp-react-count\">1<\/span>\n                        \n                                                <span class=\"twp-react-percent\"><span>100<\/span> 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aria-hidden=\"true\"><\/i><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":889,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_crdt_document":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[3,8],"tags":[315,1084,590,663,59,60,1085,1086,901,448,221,696,1087,350,789,148,351,160,1088,83,170,279,1089,281,1090],"class_list":["post-3844","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-decembrie-89","category-revolutie-sau-lovitura","tag-adunare","tag-armate","tag-cc","tag-ceausescu","tag-desteptati","tag-desteptati-va","tag-dia","tag-fortele","tag-general","tag-gorbaciov","tag-iliescu","tag-lovitura-de-stat","tag-marea","tag-nationala","tag-pcr","tag-revolutie","tag-roman","tag-securitatea","tag-sovietica","tag-tradare","tag-tratat","tag-unite","tag-uniunea","tag-urss","tag-varsovia"],"rise-blocks_total_comments":0,"rise-blocks_categories":[{"term_id":8,"name":"Revolutie sau Lovitura?","slug":"revolutie-sau-lovitura","term_group":0,"term_taxonomy_id":8,"taxonomy":"category","description":"","parent":3,"count":10,"filter":"raw"}],"rise-blocks_excerpt":"Printre participan\u0163i: Ion Iliescu (pre\u015fedinteleCFSN), Petre Roman (prim-ministrul Rom\u00e2niei), Evgheni Tiajelnikov (ambasadorul URSS la Bucure\u015ftii) Evgheni Tiajelnikov: \u00cen primul r\u00e2nd sunt bucuros c\u0103 am posibilitate, \u015fi din partea tovar\u0103\u015fului Gorbaciov \u015fi din \u00eens\u0103rcinarea lui s\u0103 \u00eenm\u00e2nez textul\u00a0 felicit\u0103rii adresate cu ocazia victoriei revolu\u0163iei \u015fi constituirii Consiliului Frontului. Nu \u00eel citesc. \u00cel cunoa\u015fte\u0163i. A fost publicat. Felicit\u0103rile au fost transmise prin..","yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v26.9 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/product\/yoast-seo-wordpress\/ -->\r\n<title>Stenograma \u00eentrevederii rom\u00e2no-sovietice din 27 decembrie 1989, ora 10.01 -<\/title>\r\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\r\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/desteptati-va.ro\/index.php\/2021\/04\/19\/stenograma-intrevederii-romano-sovietice-din-27-decembrie-1989-ora-10-01\/\" \/>\r\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"ro_RO\" \/>\r\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\r\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Stenograma \u00eentrevederii rom\u00e2no-sovietice din 27 decembrie 1989, ora 10.01 -\" \/>\r\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"Printre participan\u0163i: Ion Iliescu (pre\u015fedinteleCFSN), Petre Roman (prim-ministrul Rom\u00e2niei), Evgheni Tiajelnikov (ambasadorul URSS 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